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1 Votes - 5 Average   On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [01-04-2016]
Author MessageOn Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [01-04-2016]
Dînadan
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Post: #41
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [08-11-2015]Dînadan 11-14-2015

gIL^ Wrote:
I would love to see a 28mm chaos dwarf ship. I know the logistics are tough but that would be amazing to see, Even a small ship.

*cough*FuggitKhan'sBlog*coughcough*


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11-14-2015 07:08 AM
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gIL^
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Post: #42
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [08-11-2015]gIL^ 11-14-2015

Dînadan Wrote:

gIL^ Wrote:
I would love to see a 28mm chaos dwarf ship. I know the logistics are tough but that would be amazing to see, Even a small ship.

*cough*FuggitKhan'sBlog*coughcough*


one i can buy Takes Hat off



11-14-2015 08:46 AM
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Dînadan
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Post: #43
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [08-11-2015]Dînadan 11-14-2015

gIL^ Wrote:

Dînadan Wrote:

gIL^ Wrote:
I would love to see a 28mm chaos dwarf ship. I know the logistics are tough but that would be amazing to see, Even a small ship.

*cough*FuggitKhan'sBlog*coughcough*


one i can buy Takes Hat off

Then talk him into casting it Wink


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11-14-2015 09:39 AM
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Admiral
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Post: #44
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [08-11-2015]Admiral 11-14-2015

@Jackswift: It would be great to have 3D-designed and printed vessels without print lines in the range, especially since the geometric shapes of the models would lend themselves to it. I'd really like to see someone savvy in those crafts turn out a ship fit for a mould. Happy

@gIL^: That'd be the dream, wouldn't it? I'd love to, but my own limited skills and the very limited market for such a pricey object makes it unlikely. Maybe way down the road, but even then it wouldn't be much more than a gunboat, and still cost a lot.



Craneship

A lightly armed and humble tugboat/craneship/cargoship/trawler/supply ship. The work horse of the navy. Any respectable war fleet need a merchant fleet to protect, even if those merchant vessels with few exceptions partake in loading up slaves and loot as part of the empire's insatiable and ruthless hunger for power and wealth. This ship can be used for convoy scenarios as well as for scenarios to salvage wrecks or plunder valuables from the bottom of the sea. It can even be pressed into true military service when desperation calls. The diving bell can easily be cut off by the collector, should he want to get rid of it. Note the truss crane. Armament: Carronade




Fire Cannon Ship

A small escort vessel crammed with machinery and pipes, this little ship spews forth unquenchable flames akin to Greek fire, or even molten metal or liquid rocks. The bane and terror of wooden ships, it's nothing more than a floating flamethrower.



Measurement shot:



As you can see when comparing the craneship and the fire cannon ship to the cheap and expendable slave galley and demolition ship, these two escorts are part of the mainstay of the evil dwarf navy, and decorated accordingly. Furthermore, the lack of a cabin on the top deck hints at the location of the steersman below deck to save space on the minimalistic escort vessels, and keep the helmsman away from sharpshooters up in the crow's nest of other ships. Below deck, lower-ranked sailors equipped with donkey eared binoculars unhatch the triangular lids (the "dags" or arrow head decorations) to observe the surroundings and relay information to the steersman. It's a clunky and convoluted system, just like the evil dwarves themselves are.


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This post was last modified: 09-11-2017 04:42 AM by Admiral.

11-14-2015 06:08 PM
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Grimstonefire
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Post: #45
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Grimstonefire 11-14-2015

When I get down to surface level detail, I'm certaintly going to bring in many of your design elements Admiral.

I love all your boats, they're really good.

My only observation might be to file or very thinly slice flat the tops of chimneys to make edges a bit sharper.


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11-14-2015 06:35 PM
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Admiral
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Post: #46
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Admiral 11-14-2015

Thanks a lot! Good idea, though I lack a hobby file and will first have to consider taking a knife to the chimney tops. Not that good with blades or straight lines, I'm afraid.

Besides, do you happen to know a caster and mouldmaker firm to recommend? I'm considering sending the escorts off to a caster quite soon after they're ready, to get the first mould started early and pave the way for our kits with bigger ships.

Also, please shout if any of you want to make some small escort of your own! If that's the case, then we can wait with the mould for sure. I'm just assuming that everyone's main interest will lie in the big boats. Wink


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And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
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This post was last modified: 11-14-2015 07:49 PM by Admiral.

11-14-2015 07:33 PM
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gIL^
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Post: #47
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]gIL^ 11-15-2015

Perhaps cad designed and 3d printed is the way for bigger boats.

I will buy a good share of your boats, because chaos dwarf.



11-15-2015 06:55 AM
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Admiral
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Post: #48
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Admiral 11-15-2015

Nice to hear!

CAD-design of big boat components and 3d-printing could work for distribution of 28mm scale vessels (i.e. someone makes the templates and puts them up online, maybe for free, and people can print out boat parts at home). Making the hull hollow by assembling it like a tank kit would save some materials for the printer. I wish I had the skill with such programs to pull it off, but I struggle with learning even the simpler stuff. Perhaps, gIL^, if you ask Jackswift very kindly or bribe him...? Wink


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXV - Voting Deadline 13th of September ...  Admiralty Miniatures Blogshop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings: Fables. Songs. Sayings. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Path to Glory: Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules.

This post was last modified: 11-15-2015 07:27 AM by Admiral.

11-15-2015 07:19 AM
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Ikkred Pyrhelm
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Post: #49
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Ikkred Pyrhelm 11-15-2015

Followed the link on the UE (I really need to keep my eye-things open more... Shock )

Looking great thus far, some fantastic details and ideas. Colour me very interested. Happy


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11-15-2015 07:29 AM
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Grimstonefire
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Post: #50
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Grimstonefire 11-15-2015

Which country would you be planning to get these cast in?  I don't really know many casters to recommend and my knowledge is dated (about 2 years).  So fresh research required.

I've been doing bits and pieces on the second boat today, the catamaran.  I've pretty much done the basic assembly but I'll take a photo when that's done.

I imagine I'm going to make 3 boats and build all up to a basic level then greenstuff them all.  The catamaran will be my daemonic ship I think. so some extra thinking required.


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This post was last modified: 11-15-2015 04:44 PM by Grimstonefire.

11-15-2015 04:43 PM
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Admiral
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Post: #51
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Admiral 11-15-2015

@Ikkred Pyrhelm: Thanks! Hope you'll like the whole range once finished. Happy

@Grimstonefire: I had loosely planned to contact some British caster, since I'm under the impression there exists a few such firms over in the UK, although I've not yet researched closer. The country of the caster wouldn't matter too much as long as his reputation is sound and services good. I'm currently working with a Czech caster who runs Custom Made Miniatures to produce an animated dwarf statue, which is likely to arrive before Christmas. That caster is very busy and one will have to expect long waiting times. Though it doesn't bother me much that particular statue model is late, I wouldn't contact CMM to do the casting for our ships.

A guy over on Warseer shared his couple of finds after searching for casters:

hagen88 Wrote:
"After some researches I found this company:
http://www.griffinmoulds-jjp.com/our-services/
They are UK based and they received some good feedbacks for their metal sculpts from Hasslefree miniatures, who regularly employs them to cast their miniatures.
I contacted them, along with another resin cast company:
http://zealotminiatures.com/
and ask both of them about their prices and avilability, so now is basically just wait and see what they come up with."


I had thought of asking the above mentioned firms, and ask you and Baggronor for recommendations. And see if we could find any other companies to pick and choose from.

Neat plan for the ships, particularly the catamaran. Looking forward to see it! Perhaps we can recycle some of your left-over ideas in other large ships which others will make?


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And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings: Fables. Songs. Sayings. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Path to Glory: Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules.

This post was last modified: 11-15-2015 05:28 PM by Admiral.

11-15-2015 05:26 PM
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Grimstonefire
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Post: #52
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Grimstonefire 11-15-2015

I've used griffin before, for all my metal CD actually, they were very good.  But I don't know if they do resin?

My thinking is that of the larger ships we make say 10-12 ships between us and decide on 7 or so to cast (especially once we get some estimates on price).

Anyone tempted to have a go at a steampunk sea creature like the Black Kraken?


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This post was last modified: 11-15-2015 06:10 PM by Grimstonefire.

11-15-2015 06:09 PM
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Jackswift
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Post: #53
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Jackswift 11-16-2015

@Admiral:  A very nice collection of ships thus far.  The details are very chaos dwarf, and will look nice carried across the range of ships to one degree or another.  I can see the beam and triangle motif carried across the lower hull of the battleship and assault ship.  Love the detail on the crane ship.  Are you going for a one piece from the side mold, or does the crane piece detach?

Quote:
CAD-design of big boat components and 3d-printing could work for distribution of 28mm scale vessels


Hmm... small scale ships would come first and would be a good test of the printer once it is assembled.  Further out though... I need some more practice with Blender before I tackle anything of that scale and level of detail.  

Grimstonefire Wrote:
Anyone tempted to have a go at a steampunk sea creature like the Black Kraken?


I have a couple of ideas along those lines.  Thinking a nautilus style ship\submersible (the sea creature, not Nemo's monster).  Will try to sketch it up this week.  The trick would be making something easily castable.

11-16-2015 01:04 PM
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Admiral
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Post: #54
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Admiral 11-16-2015

@Grimstonefire: I'll ask Griffin about resin. Yes, having a few models in excess won't hurt, though I'd dislike to see any of your 3 vessels or Jackswift's two present sketches be rejected from the moulds. Would it be wise to limit ourselves in our planning right away to avoid rejected sculpts as far as possible?

E.g. you'd take on 3 ships, the chainsaw, the hammer and the demonic catamaran. If we want to get out more ship types without throwing in more hulls, making the hammer ship or the catamaran multi-part to include rocket launchers (or something esle) would go a long way toward providing collectors/players with equipment variety. Jackswift has so far come up with a Merrimac-based battleship and Monitor assault cruiser, both of which could be multi-part with optional great rocket for the battleship, and whatever we fancy for the Monitor (rockets, torpedo tubes, slave cages, demonic altar...). That makes 5 large ship hulls in total.

On top of this, Fuggit Khan will contribute with a ship later on, and Red Skullz has signed up to build a multi-part submersible with hull drill and mechanical tentacles as alternatives. 7 in total, with possible space for one more vessel, though it'd preferably be something wacky and out of the ordinary to warrant a place. And as a crown for the range, an oceanic ziggurat could lie ahead in the future. Maybe.

We'll all reach an agreement regarding what we want to see in the fleet, at least for the big ships which are the most important (escorts are but a sideshow). The below list is a preiliminary proposition, please discuss and share your own ideas for the range:

Evil Dwarf Fleet Wrote:
Escorts One mould
Demolition ship
Fire demon ship
Fire cannon ship
Craneship w. carronade
Slave galley w. ballista
Double-decker slave galley with corvus assault bridge?

Ships of the Line Two-three moulds
Chainsaw ship
Hammer ship (optional rockets?)
Demon catamaran w. cannons
Assault ship w. turrets and pickaxes (optional harpoon gun, rocket or torpedo tubes?)
Battleship w. broadside batteries and great cannon (optional great rocket?)
Nautilus Submersible w. mechanical tentacles (optional hull drill?)
Fuggit's surprise
Something utterly bizarre? (Empty slot for something special, preferably w. bizarre steampunk & unholy demonic forces)


What do you all think about it? Note the proposed rocket options. The fleet needs some rocket artillery, though not necessarily on all the above mentioned ships. Note also the proposed options for the assault ship. As a light cruiser, it's versatile and may be equipped with a variety of weapons.

Is something fundamental to the range missing in the above list? We'd positively have to cover the necessary archetypes such as fire, shackled demons/mysticism, steam engines, ostentatious decoration, odd close combat ships, mortar and rocket artillery, slavery and plain craziness.

Though not an aquatic bronze bull with flippers. Tongue


@Jackswift: Thanks! The details are quite simple to make and repeat on a larger scale, which will come in handy for the battleship and assault ship. I'm aiming for side moulds on all the escorts to keep them simple, so the crane won't detach unless hacked off.

Good to hear you've got some idea for a nautilus sub. Ammonites have always been a favourite ancient sea creature of mine, and nautili aren't far off. Red Skullz will sculpt the submersible in due time once he's finished a couple of projects (don't expect anything before Christmas), and I bet he'll willingly work with your concept sketch as a basis, and naturally also a plasticard frame as a basis should you wish to make one for him. I believe any mechanical tentacles would have to be sculpted on bent needles pinned into part of the vessel.

Also, please see the proposed weapon options for the Monitor assault ship in the list above. The boarding hammers are a must, yet we could include optional weaponry for collectors to equip it with.


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXV - Voting Deadline 13th of September ...  Admiralty Miniatures Blogshop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings: Fables. Songs. Sayings. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Path to Glory: Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules.

This post was last modified: 11-16-2015 03:48 PM by Admiral.

11-16-2015 02:10 PM
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Grimstonefire
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Post: #55
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Grimstonefire 11-16-2015

It strikes me (no pun intended) that the list is very heavily combat focused.

I don't know how these games work but I imagined at least half being gunboats.
Or would those be a larger class of ships?


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11-16-2015 03:57 PM
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Admiral
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Post: #56
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Admiral 11-16-2015

It's nothing compared to this list. We could perhaps bring in more artillery by putting minor turrets, rockets or cannons on combat-oriented large ships? Likewise, the Nautilus could sport some kind of ranged weapon. The proposed weapon options would also help balance the melee, if carried through to the kits.

Long-range artillery is more effective, but close quarters shoot-outs, boardings and ramming is evocative and may easily show up in fantasy fleet actions, even one sporting steamships, rockets and big guns. Probably everyone interested wants to see a chainsaw and hammer ship, so we might as well deliver. "Drive me closer, I want to hit them with my sword," comes to mind. Also, having close-quarters capability better allows for piracy and the capture of foreign ships, cargo and crew for loot and slaves.

That said, should we perhaps have one more escort boat, equipped with rockets or mortar?


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXV - Voting Deadline 13th of September ...  Admiralty Miniatures Blogshop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings: Fables. Songs. Sayings. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Path to Glory: Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules.

This post was last modified: 11-16-2015 05:15 PM by Admiral.

11-16-2015 05:13 PM
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Dînadan
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Post: #57
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Dînadan 11-18-2015

My Uncharted Seas order came today - for reference, here's the sizes of the Shroud Mages' ships:

Flagship: 15cm
Tormentor class heavy cruiser: 9.5cm
Stalker class cruiser: 8.9cm
Darkness class cruiser: 9.1cm
Infiltrator class destroyer: 8cm
Adept class destroyer: 7.4cm
Lurker/Illuminator class frigate: 4.4cm
Ripper class submarine: 11cm (base), 9cm (no base)


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11-18-2015 02:00 PM
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Admiral
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Post: #58
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Admiral 11-19-2015

Thank you, Dînadan!

Zealot Miniatures have responded on resin casting. They have a flat rate of £35 for the mould (which would double if a batch did not fit in one mould), and a flat rate of £4,5 per casting (service and materials), plus VAT. With costs for shipping of casts and a slim profit margin on top we might be looking at an end price for the customer of circa £8 per unit (batch of 5 escort vessels) plus shipping, should Zealot Miniatures become our caster. Let's await an answer from Griffin and see if we can find any other casters to inquire.

Assuming we'll let Zealot do the casting: Note that the plan is to simply cast the escort boats in the master mould without tailoring (which is £25 per mould, and £1.50-£2 per ship, depending on size and complexity) for the sake of cheapness and the simplicity of the small ships. Larger ships might likely end up getting tailored. I'll try to keep the price reasonably low and offer some volume discount for customers ordering several units of escorts.

Edit: Will be away for some days, but should be home by next week.


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXV - Voting Deadline 13th of September ...  Admiralty Miniatures Blogshop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings: Fables. Songs. Sayings. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Path to Glory: Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules.

This post was last modified: 11-19-2015 08:14 AM by Admiral.

11-19-2015 06:36 AM
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Admiral
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Post: #59
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [14-11-2015]Admiral 11-23-2015

Fire Demon Ship

A sturdy escort vessel, filled with slave pens and charged with mysterious sorcery which is unleashed at blood-soaked sacrificial invocation ceremonies, whereby demons of fire from beyond are summoned, tamed and chained to the altar. These terrifying apparitions of fire are the fear of any sailor aboard rickety vessels of mere wood, and a testament to the evil dwarf powers of enslavement. This shackled demon, however, is not always safely contained or mastered... Note the demon in full sprint, restrained by heavy chains. Note the naked idol. The idea was to go for something different than the statue aboard the slave galley, so I opted for basing it loosely on this Sumerian ceremonial procession, though bowing in mock humility instead of carrying vessels and offerings.



And the escorts together:



I'll be away from home this week, so might be late in replying. Have a good time, folks! Happy


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXV - Voting Deadline 13th of September ...  Admiralty Miniatures Blogshop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings: Fables. Songs. Sayings. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Path to Glory: Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules.

This post was last modified: 09-11-2017 04:43 AM by Admiral.

11-23-2015 02:48 PM
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Fuggit Khan
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Post: #60
RE: On Dark Tides - Cooperative blog for sculpting and casting ships [23-11-2015]Fuggit Khan 11-23-2015

Beautiful work there Mr Admiral Takes Hat off
It's a joy to look at all the intricate details that you've sculpted (I wish I had such marvelous sculpting skills as yours)...and kudos for the historical Sumerian influences on the design.
And I love the Man O' War battlebarge lower hull design too, it makes such a nice tie in to the Man O' War classic ship style Cheers!


"Where there's a whip, there's a way!"
11-23-2015 04:30 PM
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