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1 Votes - 5 Average   Make Zharr-Naggrund Great Again
Author MessageMake Zharr-Naggrund Great Again
Xander
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Post: #41
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainXander 08-22-2018

Great contributions, all.

I think everyone is on the right track. Facebook groups are the easiest way to share and show off miniatures right now. But they do lack the "forum atmosphere". Rarely are you making friends within these groups and it all feels pretty shallow most of the time. I feel like you never get deep conversations or rules development, and other things of this sort; and there's no cataloging or archival, effectively, of great content.

The only way to "compete" with FB groups would be to have forum software that made it just as easy to post your pictures as the Facebook app does on your phone. If anyone knows of such software, I'd love to see it. I'm constantly on the lookout for great forum software, but I've never really found anything that made switching to it (and abandoning all this history) worth it.

If we found really good forum software, it may be wise to "move on" from this forum, keep it as an archive, but lock it all down. Make it read-only. I have a lot of misgivings about that though, we lose so much history doing that, and may even lose users doing it. The forum software is old. We run an old version of PHP on a dedicated server just to keep it running. Our host kept trying to update our PHP to keep it current and eventually the forum software was so old, it would just break with newer versions of PHP.

With the return of Necromunda, I have been doing a lot of hobbying lately. And shamefully, I haven't been posting any of it here. I just post on FB groups, it's easy, simple, and I do it from my phone. Sad but true. The upshot is that I actually painted some Chaos Dwarfs lately, amazingly! 20 acolytes and my Lamassu!

CDO thrived by having a half-dozen or more community leaders with great armies that were examples to follow. For me personally, that included users like Grimstonefire, Exquisite Evil, Snotling and Ishkur. They were the ones I initially admired and tried to emulate the most. They were using the current dwarf range of miniatures to make Chaos Dwarfs.

The Battle for Skull Pass set was an amazing "in" for new CD players. Nicodemus kindly pointed out that my work using that kit helped inspire him. BFSP was practically a whole CD army in a box, complete with goblin slaves. It was the Warhammer boxed game, it was the now, the newest thing, easy to get excited about. I think focusing on AoS going forward does make the most sense. It's the now, now. But we'll always have room for legacy Chaos Dwarf content, just as we always honoured the 3rd edition range and their fans.

The Age of Sig Zharr FB group is actually pretty well subscribed and it's where Chaos Dwarf players in the Age of Sigmar gather, that seems fairly clear to me. I've attached the miniatures of an Age of Sig Zharr member, Callum Curnin, who has converted Infernal Guard from the Ironbreakers, they are pretty excellent, and definitely in the old tradition of modifying existing dwarfs. His work feels like an echo of the CDO spirit. Something to inspire potentially Chaos Dwarf generals.

If you aren't already, I encourage everyone to join this FB group (and the CDO FB group as well). Take a look at what the AoS fans are up to. We may need to "poach" some of the great exemplars for this new Age. Callum even said that he had/has an old CDO account. We need to get him back here, perhaps. Heck, I need to get myself back here!






I think we should move forward with the consolation plan ASAP. And then make some changes to highlight and encourage AoS adoption. Featuring great AoS armies on the home page News section would also help instantiate this new plan and present a model(s!) for emulation.

I know I've been long absent from the site. Interests wax and wane. But as Mark has aptly expressed, I am not sad that it's over, I am happy that it happened. This was the best Warhammer community on the web for a great long time. And we definitely need an eye on the future for the next big thing. AoS2 might be a good horse to attach our cart to. Perhaps the pain of the end of WHFB has run its course and people are ready for something new.

Having just painted a bunch of my old Chaos Dwarfs that remained unpainted for years, I pretty well have a full shelf of Chaos Dwarfs in the style of the Hellcannon. The Hellcannon look used to be the new look, the new hotness. It's not any more, and I accept that.

It might be time to move onto the new thing at last. Adapt or die.



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This post was last modified: 08-22-2018 09:49 PM by Xander.

08-22-2018 09:47 PM
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Admiral
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Post: #42
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainAdmiral 08-23-2018

Well pondered, Xander! Takes Hat off

On consolidation of current site: I'd love to see a consolidation kicking off soon. We'll have to agree on exact layout: cornixt and I have shared a couple of proposals (leave tutorials and stories intact as their own sections, and I'm really fine with anything). More ideas? What to pick?

We'll have to leave this section and this section intact for the time being even as the rest of the forum gets remade, because people on EEFL are working on salvaging it thoroughly for 8th edition players' use. When they give green light, we can finally merge it with the rest of Tactics. Should we leave this section temporarily intact as well, to be salvaged, and then merge when copied over?

I also think the pinned CD art thread and CD rune thread should be moved over to Background stories & Art, if we were to consolidate like I proposed in that area. Then replace them with pinned big AoS, T9A and KoW CD threads respectively.

I'll be awfully busy until perhaps the 10th of September, but I'll volunteer to move over threads after that if this is to be done manually: Or can an admin with tech know-how merge entire forum sections in a heartbeat?


On transformation into a new site: If you are to find new software and put old CDO into frozen archive read-only mode, please give us at least two months' worth of time and loud warning beforehand. This will allow us to both ease the transition for active members, tie up potential loose knots (not least regarding organizing the background stories section) and perhaps minimize loss of returning users by mass send-outs of PMs/E-mail to more or less inactive well-established members that are most likely to come back one day (having them not be put off by the transformation but stay onto CDO in its new incarnation would be worth a lot).

It will also allow us to copy-paste resource threads for reposting on the new site, before the old forum goes into read-only mode: This is invaluable, since we can then smoothly copy the entirety of the art thread compilation, 10 years of CDO thread, the juice parts of the CD mine thread and a ton of stories, not to speak of tutorials and so much else. We'd obviously leave big links to the new site on the old, and well visible link to the old archive site on the new, but so much can be won and saved if we can move over entirely the best resources to a new shiny site, making it not only a fresher start, but one which doesn't cut out the best of the old stuff that has accumulated.

If new forum software was to be found, then would it be possible or desirable to introduce "tag labels" (or whatever they are called), as can be found on Lustria Online? I.e. when a new thread is created, the OP tags it as e.g. T9A, AoS, KoW, WHFB in CD general or stories section, or tagged as something else entirely. Random thought. Currently we put in AoS, T9A etc. in the topic names.

Xander Wrote:
The Hellcannon look used to be the new look, the new hotness. It's not any more, and I accept that.


Given the very good masked Hellcannon style conversions, by Callum Curnin, in the pictures you just shared, it would seem the Hellcannon look is one of timeless quality, not just a flimsy summer fashion. Seems healthy enough to my eyes, just like big hats keep steaming on decades after first being the new thing. Tongue

Also, looking forward to see your new paintjobs, Daemonsmith.

Cheers!


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This post was last modified: 08-23-2018 09:03 AM by Admiral.

08-23-2018 09:02 AM
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Xander
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Post: #43
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainXander 08-27-2018

So I merged some subforums and rearranged some things. Seems tighter now.

I've also started some preliminary testing of forum upgrading to see exactly what that might look like, or if it is even possible. My first attempt had an SQL failure. So I've attempted to circumvent that issue and am starting on a second attempt.

Edit: 2nd attempt was a bust, but I could still correct for it. 3rd attempt was a complete failure with no real indication of what went wrong. So it looks like a straight upgrade is out of the picture. Next thing to try would be a fresh MyBB install that can somehow import the forum DB, but I am not hopeful!


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This post was last modified: 08-27-2018 10:34 PM by Xander.

08-27-2018 09:56 PM
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Nicodemus
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Post: #44
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainNicodemus 08-28-2018

Xander Wrote:
Next thing to try would be a fresh MyBB install that can somehow import the forum DB, but I am not hopeful!


Thanks for looking into this and putting in some time! It's greatly appreciated. Send me a PM if I can help in any way or text/FB mesasge me.. I think you still have all of my contact info.

~N


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08-28-2018 04:31 AM
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Admiral
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Post: #45
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainAdmiral 08-28-2018

Thank you very much Xander! Great work and much appreciated.

Shouldn't Conversions be merged with Army Blogs and Showcase, though? All conversion threads I can remember (and I salvaged the lot yesteryear) were simply showcasing sculpts and conversions, incl. at least three sculptor's CD sculpting blogs. It seemed they would have fit in fine with army blogs & showcase, lots of overlap.

Nothing major, just a reflection.

Anyway, thanks for putting in time here! Takes Hat off


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXVII - Voting Deadline 3rd of July  ...  Etsy shop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings:
Fables. Songs. Proverbs. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules. Ninth Age concepts.
08-28-2018 06:45 AM
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Xander
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Post: #46
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainXander 08-28-2018

I opted to put conversions with Ideas and Advice. Seemed cleaner to me. Happy


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08-28-2018 06:48 AM
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Xander
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Post: #47
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainXander 08-28-2018

Cleaned up this section a bit tonight: http://www.chaos-dwarfs.com/forum/forumd...php?fid=13

Unstuck some old stickies, updated some useful threads, and generally am just trying to clear some clutter.

I also fixed the thumbnail issue on the main site. Happy


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This post was last modified: 08-28-2018 10:14 PM by Xander.

08-28-2018 09:58 PM
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tjub
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Post: #48
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great Againtjub 08-29-2018

Great work you guys!

Xander: One thing Id like to see if there is a new version in the future. An ability much like FB to upload an image directly when making a thread, and have it showing even if not loged in and in a bigger version than now. Would also be sweet to be possible to add the image to a "user gallery/album" when uploading content. That way we could have images in threads with context as well as viewing a members gallery with the best army photos etc.


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08-29-2018 12:36 AM
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Xander
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Post: #49
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainXander 08-29-2018

Yeah, tjub, I completely agree. Having both a gallery and in-line image uploading as simple as facebook would really be ideal.

I just tried installing the newest version of MyBB and tried Tapatalk integration. While it does make uploading pictures fairly easy on mobile, those images are going onto the Tapatalk servers, so it doesn't seem like an optimal solution. The newest version of MyBB didn't impress me, I have to say, it doesn't even have a mobile/responsive friendly theme by default. Truly sad for web software in 2018.

Seems like my hunt for great software will continue.

EDIT: I've stumbled upon some software that has me a bit interested. I have a demo going, I'd encourage anyone who wants to try it out to check it out:
https://382f30.woltlab-demo.com/

If you are prompted for credentials when accessing the website, please use these login details:
Username: demo
Password: sj3cam1c7h

The, once you have access, you can sign up for an account. Sign up for an account and play around! Test it on your phone too. Happy


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This post was last modified: 08-29-2018 10:42 PM by Xander.

08-29-2018 09:00 PM
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tjub
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Post: #50
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great Againtjub 08-30-2018

Im no tech-wiz but from what I can tell it does look a lot better than the current version atleast. With a lot more possibilities, dont know how easy it would be to "loose stuff" there? But from what I can tell it looks great!


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08-30-2018 12:30 AM
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Xander
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Post: #51
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainXander 08-30-2018

tjub Wrote:
Im no tech-wiz but from what I can tell it does look a lot better than the current version atleast. With a lot more possibilities, dont know how easy it would be to "loose stuff" there? But from what I can tell it looks great!

I've been very impressed with it so far. It even has trophies built in. The only missing piece is a Wiki, but I've seen it as a plugin on another site using this software. Notably, the Ninth Age site is using this tech, so I'm going to register there to get a better understanding of the user experience. Happy


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08-30-2018 08:55 AM
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TrudiFurioso
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Post: #52
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainTrudiFurioso 08-31-2018

Just great work Xander!

I'm trying right now the software! It looks more like a blog and, it's kinda strange. The feel is so different from THIS but, ill get used to it if it's needed for the Glory of The Great Bull.

08-31-2018 02:34 AM
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TrudiFurioso
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Post: #53
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainTrudiFurioso 08-31-2018

I'll happily contribute with some drawings for banners and graphics in general if needed, just hook me up!

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Admiral
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Post: #54
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainAdmiral 03-08-2019

@TrudiFurioso: Yes please! We'd love to see your great artwork. Please return soon. Happy


Right, folks, let's see if we can get something going that doesn't require technical knowhow.

Let's brainstorm up what should be in the Introductions & CDO Information forum.

What is missing there, for a beginner wanting to know something fundamental? What should be there?


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And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings:
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There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules. Ninth Age concepts.

This post was last modified: 03-08-2019 12:11 PM by Admiral.

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Admiral
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Post: #55
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainAdmiral 03-12-2019

Okey, let's try another note!

Ladies and gentlemen, check out tjub's introduction post to 15mm KoW wargaming.

We've got a split scene where there is no longer a monolithic wargaming system common to virtually everyone. Age of Sigmar, various old Warhammer editions, Kings of War, the Ninth Age, Dragon Rampant, Frostgrave. The list goes on.

I'm thinking we could do well to have a sticky thread here in Chaos Dwarf General Discussion, or perhaps in CDO Information, where one player of each game introduce it for budding evil dwarf generals in 28mm. Interesting units, restrictions (or lack thereof), basing and so on. With pictures. A helpful post for each wargame, including older Warhammer editions. And no sharp elbows against other systems. With an Age of Sigmar write-up on top of the list, since that is the current direct heir of Warhammer Fantasy and thus its Chaos Dwarfs. To help people get use out of their evil dwarf miniatures, and ease entry into the wargames. Maybe a locked thread until we've got the current main 28mm fantasy wargames out there covered?

Thoughts?

And more to the point...

Volunteers? Wink



I'm too narrowly into the creative background/artwork side of things to be much use in presenting any wargame, but I'll gladly help volunteers with writing their presentations, if help is wanted.


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXVII - Voting Deadline 3rd of July  ...  Etsy shop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings:
Fables. Songs. Proverbs. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules. Ninth Age concepts.

This post was last modified: 03-12-2019 01:11 PM by Admiral.

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tjub
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Post: #56
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great Againtjub 03-12-2019

Sure, its a good idea! If requested I could do a shorter version for Blood Bowl as well? Ill try an update the 15mm KoW a bit later on with more direct references to different books etc.


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03-12-2019 04:19 PM
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Post: #57
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great AgainGargolock 04-06-2019

Just a little Something here, my friend visited chaos dwarf online after stumbling upon it when researching the faction (mainly to see what he had to look forward too whilst fighting me).

He encountered the homepage and looked around the navigation panel’s site pinned links to the archives and galleries. Most of those links appear to be forgotten or neglected as the golden hat archive is 10 golden hats behind, the goldendaemon winner picture gallery doesn’t have ravenswood and the word of hashut files are now replaced by error messages. Maybe those links to download the word of hashuts should be removed or replaced with the Issuu links.

Those site links are most of the time the second thing people see other than the current contest or announcement, they should probably be updated to show more current CDO as everything on there is back from 2014 and earlier.  
My friend after seeing that thought CDO was like all other Warhammer forums, lifeless and just full of old WHFB threads with some players still trying to stir up the community.

However CDO is still filled with life and creativity. I would attribute this too the fact that if you play chaos dwarfs you are bound to naturally be resourceful or used to having to strive. They haven’t been the most respected race by GW and have always needed their players to have a little bit of self direction.

Truly I believe they should be updated to show that CDO is still updating itself and flowing with wargaming and maybe add new sections about other aspects of the community like lore or other wargames . I also think the new wargame introductions should be links as well. Also the fan made rules edition should have Thommy H’s battletome for chaos dwarfs and not his first AoS rulebook. His battletome has more balanced rules and just more.
To make CDO have more traffic come into it it must present itself as something deserving of new traffic which means those pinned galleries should be current and show the current community and state of CDO and members on CDO and what they are doing. Maybe put on the site section the list of chaos dwarf models Admiral made.


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This post was last modified: 04-06-2019 12:13 AM by Gargolock.

04-06-2019 12:05 AM
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tjub
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Post: #58
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great Againtjub 04-06-2019

True, always go strait to the forum so doesn't even think of that part anymore. Reason is as you say, its not updated anymore nor has been for quite some time. Maybe give it the same treatment at the forum got? Compile it all under something called "Archive 2008-2014" and only keep the living parts on the menu?

Good feedback Gargolock.


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This post was last modified: 04-06-2019 02:23 AM by tjub.

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Group: Immortals
Market Rep: 13
Slaves: 1483
Army Showcase Best Hobbyist - 2008 Word of Hashut - Contributor Diamond Army Medal - 8000 PTS Best Hobbyist - 2009 Artisan's Contest - Gold Best Hobbyist - 2010 Veteran Medal - Bronze Golden Hat - Bronze x2 Best Hobbyist - 2011 Image Gallery Contributor - Silver Best Hobbyist - 2012 Golden Hat - Silver Dark Apostle - Bronze Photobucket Migration Hellsmith - Gold Major Prize Sponsor Golden Hat - Gold Best Hobbyist - 2018                               
Post: #59
RE: Make Zharr Naggrund Great Againtjub 04-06-2019

Here is a suggestion... Takes Hat off
   

Edit: Should of course read 2014 not 2914. Tongue


Intro to 15mm Kings of War
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This post was last modified: 04-06-2019 02:21 AM by tjub.

04-06-2019 02:21 AM
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Admiral
Auxilliary Moderator
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Posts: 6,908 - May 2011
Group: Hashut's Admin
Market Rep: 9
Slaves: 142
Scribe's Contest - Bronze x3 Best Attitude - 2014 Best Contributor - 2014 Major Prize Sponsor Golden Hat - Bronze x2 Scribe's Contest Veteran Scribe's Contest Silver Hellsmith - Gold Dark Apostle - Silver Best Attitude - 2015 Best Overall Member - 2015 Best Contributor - 2015 Artisan's Contest - Silver x2 Best Overall Member - 2016 Best Contributor - 2016 Artisan's Contest - Gold Best Contributor - 2017 Best Attitude - 2017                               
Post: #60
Drifting on Autopilot With a Skeleton CrewAdmiral 04-06-2019

Well, we're certainly in need of new, active Staff members with technical knowhow or willingness to learn things technical. Big Grin

Volunteers wanted!


I don't have the technical knowhow for updating the front page. Had it been as simple as writing a forum post, then it would have been kept updated long ago.

When I volunteered back in 2014 (following a lapse in contests as the Staff members understandably all got too busy with their lives, and because I wanted to launch writing competitions) I also announced that Word of Hashut would be given a shot, with loads and loads of material collected. However, it soon became apparent that as far as technical things mattered, I had already been promoted to my incompetence level. Those tech-things proved beyond me. Contests were easy, and as such I were a temporary solution that stuck.

I'll gladly keep running contests permanently for years ahead, and help with resource salvage/transfer if a new site is to be set up so we don't lose our treasures, but fundamentally Chaos Dwarfs Online has been drifting on autopilot with a skeleton crew for years now.

The last one who put an effort into updating the front page index was the indomitable Bloodbeard during 2015. He did update the army gallery section, but it proved a pain in the neck to do. So it could not be kept up since CDO activities was a natural extension of his own hobby (and hobby should be fun), and he has now almost quit forums altogether, and will soon be honourably retired from the Staff. Along with several Staff members who have not logged in for years on end.

Ideally, we'd have some dedicated fresh blood with the knowhow, time and will to update the frontpage index. Ideally, it would be updated all the way up to the present day (a lot of ground to cover). The core Staff, who check in from time to time, are Xander, Willmark, Nicodemus and Cornixt. With me as an auxilliary helper (I've never done forum policing and never will, e.g.). Everybody else (or close enough) will soon be written off, and we'd better find candidates to fill up the list again.

If we can find some volunteer here, then we could give it a try with updating the front page. CDO did all this rigourously structured building-up of resource compilations via the front page back in the day, but nowadays it's done with sticky threads on the forums themselves, because active knowhow is lacking.

It's certainly true that Chaos Dwarfs attract creative people that are more than able to fend for themselves. But it should also be noted, that while all Warhammer army forums have shrunk or died off, Lustria Online steams on with vigour. They have a dedicated active Staff the like of which CDO sported 9 years ago, who keep the site polished and up-to-date with Wiki articles, contests and so on. Lizardmen never were left out in the cold by Games Workshop, and still they have pulled off more or less the same thing that Chaos Dwarfs Online achieved. So while everybody else has declined markedly (but with CDO still remaining vibrantly creative!), Lustria Online has gone from strength to strength. They're the exception to the rule, with CDO being half of an exception.


Something to aspire to.


I've no idea how they have managed to pull this impressive stunt off. It's more than understandable that real life and family demands time from Staff members so that they cannot run things as they once did.

It's very inspiring to watch Lustria Online's activity. I share T9A concept ideas there, and similar stuff, and in the process I've come to realize that it's fully possible to run a lively army forum even in these days of Facebook and a split fantasy hobby scene. They've done so.

I'd like to see us snowball one step at a time, and reach up to Lustria Online's levels (the levels we at CDO ourselves were at - famously so - back in the day). It should be possible. But if not, we're still an active creative hobby hub and in a rather good spot as of present, all things considered.

So first of all, any volunteers?

Otherwise I support tjub's proposal to archive the previous front page resources to have them remain available, but not be our untended shop front. But first replace Word of Hashut links with working ones!

Also, I'd be happy for fresh meat in the Staff that could handle the yearly community awards in the future so I don't have to. Wink

Cheers


News on CDO: Artisan's Contest XXVII - Voting Deadline 3rd of July  ...  Etsy shop

And thus there was Chaos. And Squats. Hobby Group Auxillia Work. On Dark Tides. Miscellaneous Commercial Sculpts. Flayman Tutorial.
Chaos Dwarf Writings:
Fables. Songs. Proverbs. Quotes. Monumental Inscriptions. Religious Texts.
There's fourteen ways to skin a dwarf. Chaos Dwarf Warband Rules. Ninth Age concepts.

This post was last modified: 04-06-2019 05:42 AM by Admiral.

04-06-2019 04:59 AM
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